THE VICTORIAN STATE PARLIAMENT has passed new gun laws that will make it easier to slap 10-year gun bans on shooters, and require many shooters to pay for new gun safes.
Even more disappointing is that the Opposition offered little resistance to the laws – and ended up voting with the government.
The new laws mean:
- The number of police officers who can issue 10 year gun bans will jump from 55 to 299;
- Gun safes must now have steel walls of 1.6mm – and cannot be used to store other valuables in them such as passports.
We’ve already named MPs who misled parliament – and we’re about to name some more. However, we’ll congratulate a couple of others on the way through.
We’re furious.
It’s why the NSC will start targeting the electorates of some of the MPs involved as we head towards year’s Victorian State Election.
Who's to blame?
There are three from Labor. They are:
- Victoria’s Police minister, Labor MP Lisa Neville; and
- her Parliamentary Secretary, Labor MP Paul Edbrooke; and
- Labor MP Gayle Tierney, Minister for Higher Education, Training and Skills.
At the helm of the coalition’s lame response was shadow police Minister, Brad Battin. Battin, a former officer himself, showed little interest in taking the fight up with the government for Victorian shooters. His closing words on the bill were:
“But from the view of the opposition, we will not oppose this bill, and we will ensure we put through amendments in the future.”
Amendments? We’ll come back to that a bit later in this article – but we’re going to have a close look at his electorate as well.
What the new laws do
10-year gun bans
Readers will recall we recently revealed the plan to extend the delegation of the power to issue 10 year gun bans.
The laws, which we strongly opposed, will make it easier for police to ban anyone from owning firearms for 10 years for even trivial matters. They will also be subjected to warrantless searches and barred from going anywhere where firearms are stored or used.
The main problem with the laws is that they can be issued for someone’s ‘behaviour’, or who they associate with. The law does not say what that is or that the behaviour even needs to be illegal – or that the person they associate with has done anything illegal.
While the laws came into effect in 2018, the changes expand the delegation of the power to issue the bans from 55 police officers, to 299.
It is the lack of definitions in the Firearms Act that is the problem. We’re not against them being used to stop criminal activities.
However as one MP said in Parliament, they have been used against licensed shooters – and now we can expect more of these bans to be issued.
The key changes
10-year gun bans
- Labor & Libs / Nats voted to keep the gun bans in place without safeguards.
- The number of police officers who can issue them has jumped to 299.
New safe requirements
- Safes must now have steel walls 1.6mm.
- Nothing else can be stored in them
- MPs say the changes were written by shooting organisations
Gun safes
The new laws change the requirements from holding guns in containers that are made out of hardwood or steel “that is not easily penetrable”, to now only being made out steel with wall thicknesses of at least 1.6mm thickness.
In addressing the upper house on 14 October, Labor MP Gayle Tierney said
“ The subcommittee of the Victorian Firearms Consultative Committee consisting of representatives of peak firearm bodies in Victoria considered and decided upon the steel thickness of at least 1.6 millimetres for an upgraded firearm storage requirement. A steel thickness of at least 1.6 millimetres is believed not to be excessive or overly burdensome.”
Twisting the truth
The passage of the legislation through parliament contained several statements that were simply untrue.
-
THE NSC WAS CONSULTED
No he didn’t. We’ve never spoken with him. The NSC sought a meeting with Mr Battin, but we were rebuffed.
Shadow Police Minister, Gembrook MP, Brad Battin, told Parliament he consulted the NSC on the bill.
-
GUN SAFE RULES WERE WRITTEN BY SHOOTING ORGANISATIONS
Parliament was told by Paul Edbrooke that the new requirement was the result of recommendations from the Firearms Consultative Committee.
As we previously reported, sources say this is incorrect. We understand the committee recommended other options that included arrangements that Parliament wasn’t told about.Edbrooke’s claim was repeated in the upper house by upper house Labor MPs Cesar Melham then Gayle Tierney. It was then repeated by the Liberal’s Gordon Rich-Phillips – because that is what he was told by Labor.
We recommended to the Liberal Party that they ask for the Committee’s minutes to be tabled in Parliament in the interests of transparency.
However this was not done. They just took Labor’s word for it.
- THERE WAS WIDE CONSULTATION ON THE BILL
Edbrooke named members of the Firearms Consultative Committee who he said ‘made the legislation’.
There are two problems with the claim. First, is what we told you about safes. The second is this timeline:
REVEALING THE PLAN
- 22 sept 2021: NSC reveals plans for the new laws through the Weekly Times – and criticises Field and Game Australia for saying ‘responsible gun owns had nothing to fear’
- 6 Oct 2021: Field and Game Australia, who are on the committee, say they were not consulted on the 10 year gun bans. Click here to see their statement.
Around the same time, SSAA briefed its members on the changes to the laws, but did not mention the gun bans.
CONSULTATION CLAIM #1
- 7 Oct 2021: In speaking on the legislation in Parliament, Edbrooke says several organisations were not only consulted on the bans, but voted for them.
“From the outset I will say that it has been a really rewarding journey chairing the Victorian Firearms Consultative Committee. It is made up of respected organisations who represent their members very, very well. It is basically the advisory body for firearms for the Minister for Police, and all these firearms amendments were passed by a resolution, unanimously I might add, on 15 June 2021.”
He then names the organisations, including Field and Game & SSAA. The imputation is clear: every shooting organisation on the FCC supported the new laws.
CONSULTATION CLAIM #2
- 7 Oct 2021: The Member for Melton, Labor’s Steve McGhie, made the same claim.
“They are the Minister for Police’s firearms advisory body and passed a resolution on 15 June 2021 endorsing all amendments to the Firearms Act 1996 in the bill. endorsing all amendments to the Firearms Act 1996 in the bill.”
CONSULTATION CLAIM #3
-
12 Oct 2021: Labor’s Gayle Tierney repeated the claim of consultation.
“Importantly, these amendments were the subject of consultation with the Victorian Firearms Consultative Committee, which is comprised of representatives of firearm users and dealers, technical experts, law enforcement and academia.”
&
“ I do so I think it is worth pointing out that our bill has been subject to extensive consultation and development.”
CONSULTATION CLAIM #4
-
14 Oct 2021: Tierney repeats the claim of consultation.
“Thank you, Mr Rich-Phillips. My understanding is that there were a number of items that were discussed. The FPOs were presented.”
Someone’s clearly lying – and its not FGA.
What you can use a gun safe for
Only guns.
At the same sitting of parliament on 14 October, Labor’s Gayle Tierney said what you can use gun safes for:
“It is only used as a receptacle for guns, not for storage of other items in the house.”
If you were to take literally, it means you can’t store anything else in your gun safe. Not even your passport …
Amendments that were defeated
Some amendments to the legislation were proposed by the minor parties. They include:
- GEL BLASTERS & AIRSOFT
Tim Quilty (LDP) wanted to legalise gel blasters and airsoft. Labor and Liberal /Nationals opposed this so it was defeated - T-SHIRT CANNONS
Jeff Bourman (SFFP) wanted to relax the classification of t-shirt cannons as category E firearms. The result was the same as above. - FIT & PROPER PERSONS
Tim Quilty (LDP) wanted speeding and COVID fines to be excluded as reasons why a shooter is a NOT fit and proper person. Readers might recall this is a matter the NSC reported several instances where this happened last year, where shooters licences got suspended for these minor matters.
In speaking on this, the Liberal Party’s Gordon Rich-Phillips referred to our previous work on this saying:
“ It is a fact that certainly last year a number of firearm licence holders who had received infringements in relation to COVID matters—masks and the like—did receive a letter from LRD questioning their fit and proper person status to hold a firearms licence.”
Yet despite this, the Liberals / Nats voted with the Government to defeat the amendment! - FPO CONDITIONS
Tim Quilty (LDP) wanted to enable the 10 year gun ban orders conditions modified to allow for conditions to enable the person who is subject to an order to do anything that may be reasonable to do, such as dropping of kids at an in-laws place where firearms may be stored. This was defeated.
Libs fail to deliver on amendments
However one thing that really stands out to us is that the Liberal / National Party didn’t propose any amendments.
This is despite Battin saying in the lower house that the Liberals “will ensure we put through amendments”.
What some of the other MPs said
Quite a few MPs had their say on the legislation, which we felt was worth mentioning. Check out to see what the following MPs said.
While he’s a not a fan of the NSC, Mr Rich-Phllips is supportive of the shooting sports and we do think his performance is worth a gold star.
He did do a good job of asking questions and grilling the government.
However he ended up towing the party line and voted with the government to pass the legislation – without the promised amendments.
Barton paid out on the NSC offering nothing of any use to the debate. He said:
There have been some groups that have provided a view that this bill will have your local copper knocking on your door to take your firearms away for a minor traffic offence. This is not the case.
Yet he went on to say that some gun bans have been served on firearm owners.
Barton’s accusation confirms what we’ve been saying, which is that the gun bans can be issued because of unspecified ‘behaviour’. That’s way too open-ended.
Also no friend of shooters, Ms Patten raised good points about problems with the 10 year bans. Speaking as the chair of a parliamentary committee which looked into this matter, she said:
“these completely trample on fundamental human rights.”
&
“This should be an incredibly serious, serious order that really, I would say, only a court should make, but okay, we have dispensed with that; we have said that senior police officers can make this. But now this bill is amending that to say, ‘No. Junior police officers can make this; police officers, inspectors in stations can make firearms prohibition orders’”
&
“We were incredibly concerned at the ability for these orders to be issued, and we thought that it could lead to inconsistent practices and confusion. In fact we were pretty firm about this. We noted that the VCAT case that actually led to the inquiry—you know, in some ways this showed the trampling and the overarching heaviness of this legislation. The reason that VCAT heard the case and in actual fact overturned those firearm prohibition orders—and I note that obviously that order was changed—was because they thought it overrode. They thought that it was beyond what was acceptable”
Yet Patten voted with the government.
While we often disagree with him, Jeff’s performance on this bill was good.
On part of the bill affecting firearm dealers, he gave this example of why the new ban on labelling parcels was a dumb idea:
“If I was, say, Melbourne Gun Dealer Co sending it to Sydney Gun Dealer Co, what am I going to do when I want to label where it is from and where it is going to, because it will clearly be a firearm. It will be about that long, about that wide, about that thick, and heavy. I do not think it was very well thought out, and I will just seek to remove that. I do not think it is workable.”
On the storage requirements he said:
“The storage requirements are a bit of victim blaming”
He voted against the changes.
Always a strong supporter of shooting, Mr Quilty noted the problem that the new safe requirements would have for licence holders that were renters.
“If you do not own your own house, you cannot bolt down a safe, and you will no longer be able to own firearms”
As we stated earlier above, Tim also fought hard for sensible amendments which were defeated. He also voted against the bill.
What can the NSC do about this? Plenty...
The NSC is not a political party and have no range or commercial ties, which means we’re free to take on a strategy that targets any MP who does us damage, and support those who helps us.
With the Victorian State Election coming, the events of the past few days has given us a few ideas of who to pursue. These include at least two Labor MPs and a crossbencher. The double dealing of the opposition means they’re not exempt from our focus either. These will be in addition to those we have already made decisions on.
Our message to the major parties is that there is a price to pay for treating shooters with contempt. These restrictions deserve swift and decisive action and we intend to hold you to account.
How you can help
We’ll continue to expose bad behaviour and make sure our voting advice sends the message that politicians need to hear.
With a state election now not too far away, the NSC will be sending the Andrews Government a message about the shoddy way it has treated shooters. It’s a message that also needs to be heard by the Opposition, so they will be part of this as well.
If you’re unimpressed by what has been going on, then don’t cop it. Help us stop stuff like this from happening.
If you’d like to give us a hand at the Victorian State Election, let us know.
What happens when there are two or more gun owners in one house
One gets banned ?
Yep, that’s the problem. The guy with the order on him / her needs to leave the house. Even if they live there….
I would also like to know the answer to this. Where l live in the country most farmers have a gun , so does that mean if l am banned l cannot visit any of my friends or go into fishing and camping shops that sell guns?
Spot on Debra. Yes, that’s what this legislation does if it is administered the wrong way
or the ‘right way’, according to Marxist Andrews.
All I would like to say is when the shit hits the fan who will save Australia.Not the Government.
The banned gun owner will have no choice but to vacate the house shared with other gun owners otherwise every gun owner in the same house must arrange costly off site storage of their firearms. If you make it inconvenient and costly enough, a lot of people will give up their sport. It’s all being enshrined in law to diminish rights and freedoms that Australians fought and died for in the last world war. Don’t give up. Vote ………., who fight for our basic civil liberties. Keep fighting for your rights, as once we lose them, theres no getting them back.
Surely some of these people must be able to be charged with misleading parliament
They certainly should, but we all know they never will.
The entire parliament is a Freemasonic misdirection
I’m a shooter and a Freemason and many of my friends as well .don’t blame us.
Bird on a wire, I’ve seen a few of your posts and think I should point out something: a lot of statements on Facebook are deliberate lies, by the Yanks, Russians, Chinese, Iranians, Isrealis, Vatican and I don’t know whom else.
‘Flat Earth Society’ claims are a series of mental exercises. They don’t expect you to believe the world is flat, but are trying to train people who dispute them to think in a certain way. They obviously don’t understand what they’re doing, they read from a textbook and think they do (I did 3 unit calculus so I recognise the techique).
‘Freemasons’ operate in all countries and have discoursed even when their countries are at war (World War I). The Nazis infiltrated Freemasonry and promised power to people who handed over their country to German invasion. When these ‘white ants’ completed their tasks they were murdered. Political interests, the Vatican included, wish to counter the organisation. Some of the statements seem to be written by muslims.
‘Kill yourself’, said seemingly to any female, particularly young ones, who achieved something with their lives or are role models – as of the start of the working day in the middle east and not on Jewish public holidays.
The greatest effort: ‘mRNA jabs’, claiming it’s a vaccine (it’s a genetic modifier, the yanks changed the definition of vaccine in their country but that doesn’t change anything in ours); black propaganda to discredit dissent (the claim of graphene) or to drive away intelligent people (“fourth dimensional beings that feed of us” is one I remember, or just swearing) – a lot of money has been made by yank companies and an investor in them; discredit yank jabs for Russian and Chinese ones; to recruit for other (hippy/occultic) groups and, the greatest effort of all: to suppress dissidents, on an unprecedented scale, by politicians across much of the globe whom marxists claim (on social media) have suddenly boosted their wealth.
Those on this site will recognise the suppression techniques: locked out of or expelled from tertiary education, employment (thus home ownership, particularly in the cities) and social and communtiy groups, who proved they have no loyalies in the group. And slander.
I agree with K. Courte ,misleading Parliament is an offence ,or it used to be ,that rule can probably be ignored
when they all get into bed with each other ,to suit their own political agenda . Maybe after this they will target drug dealers with the same zeal .
Jack
Noooo, keep up the good work NSC. This is such an over reach, Australia is no longer the “lucky Country” its throw more rules to keep the most regulated Licence holders, being Firearm Licence holders, from living……
It’s very concerning when everyday legal law abiding shooters can have all their rights stripped away and face criminal charges, loss of firearms for no particular reason other than being at the mercy of a police officer who maybe takes a disliking to persons on a routine roadside stop.
DARK DAYS
AHEAD FOR SHOOTERS
Today’s decision by the political partys has made it possible for all victorian shooters to be seen as criminals
Police look at us with suspicion and dread thinking hes the next shooter to go nuts
My safe is a bank safe im a lucky one but are these safe rules going to be retrospect or only for new shooters
We cannot let this action slide EVERYONE needs to get out and spread the word about the situation
But will our participation in this action be misconstrued by the police
Simply handing out leaflets could be seen as incitement where does this stupidity stop
Im left woundering if i volunteer will i get targeted
CHEERS phil
On ‘ya Phil! As you know, the shooting community has beaten the drum quite a few times with a pitiful response from our own. However I think we can pull something off with not too many people if we’re smart about it….
On the concern you raised, only we will know who hand out material.
And what happens if a cop goes nuts and decide to shoot innocent people?
Methinks it is time for me to GTFO of danistan and find a more shooter friendly state. Trouble is, they are all heading in this direction.
The law is an ass, how can it be right that a person banned cannot visit law abiding family who happen to have a gun licence.
If you really want change, then you need to change the way you vote. The majors; Labor, Liberal/Nationals, Greens no longer represent the interests of the everyday person. This has been demonstrated in the government’s overreach of civil liberties during this “pandemic”, and how these “opposing” parties actually work together. Look towards supporting UAP, and Australia One Parties, who fight for our basic civil liberties.
Well said.
Newsflash, our elections are rigged just like those in America. We are living under tyrannical rule, most people just haven’t realized it yet.
Covid, Climate change & these new Victorian Firearms Regulations, are reminiscent of Keating’s statement. ‘I will do them over slowly’. Welcome folks, to the Police State where we are all being ‘done over’ by tyrants supported by ‘useful idiots’.
Will we, VIC license holders, be advised of this in writing…??
Not everyone is a member of the NSC.
Hi Justin
You don’t have to be a member but the best way to stay up to date is via our email list – top right hand corner of our front page on the black bar.
The government won’t be writing to shooters – they never do.
Regards
Neil Jenkins – NSC
Hi Neil,
I am a current member. Was just wondering about how everyone else will be informed, especially if they need a new safe…?
Thanks
Hi Justin
Ultimately it’s up to the registry to notify everyone as the are the only one who has the list of firearm licence holders. That said, we’ll continue to notify members and non-members through our social media and email list, as we have done on this occasion. Hopefully the registry will actually be a bit more reasonable than requiring strict compliance but it might take them a bit of time to work out what that should look like.
Regards
Neil Jenkins – NSC
Hi There love the responses and Justin its time you were if you value your shooting rights!, they are our only chance and a united front and sticking together!
No longer do we vote Labour,Liberal National Party.
Labour & LNP no longer represent the Australian citizen.
It’s like shortening the dogs chain one link at a time until he chokes to death , until all the shooting bodies get together and have one voice ( spokes person ) we will be stuffed , but I’m only dreaming that will never happen
Exactly, far to many egos involved, and many of them seem to roll over to political corruption!
They all need to grow up before they it’s too late
This is just SO disturbing; at the present time, it will only (?) apply to Victorians. but remember ALL Police ministers regularly consult/communicate on pertinent matter, and firearms law is a major area of discussion.
Do not be surprised to encounter “creep” with these laws, and whatever follows, to migrate across borders. Governments of a like mind (Queensland?) will be susceptible to following Victoria’s lead. As an experiment, I’ve tried to “cost” a safe to the proposed specifications; look at a five-fold increase, at least. Meanwhile many manufacturers will have thousands of surplus, unusable stock on hand, a huge cost to manufacturing and firearms industries.
I STRONGLY urge to wake up, and pressure our (?) political reps to reverse/ block these laws, regardless of where you live.
little misleading ” I’ve tried to “cost” a safe to the proposed specifications; look at a five-fold increase, at least.”
how many do you have $400-500 buys 6 rifle safe with 2mill walls 3mm door.
what are you using right now if its not a generic box from a store? school locker i bet. dont get me wrong this all seems sus that they can lie in permanent and not get kicked out for perjury
Of course Lisa Neville is in there. She has singlehandedly dragged Vicpol’s name through the mud in recent years. She’s an absolute disgrace. Hopefully IBAC finds more eels lurking in this horrendous Sate Government barrel! Leave the shooters alone you lunatics – you’re the problem, not us!
Exactly these politicians have flooded Australia with criminals and we are now paying the price
Just a little bit of information
If you need an ex bank safe
Endorced carriers in behind festival hall Melbourne have a few for sale
Theydeliver and install
Cheers phil
Boy’s, don’t stop punchin!
This whole situation is wrong for all of us innocent license gun holder being treating as criminals. This is no different when John howard collected semi automatic registered guns in 1996 as it did not achieve anything as there is plenty of unregistered guns floating around still
The Chief justice of the High Court ruled that “a pretend law made in excess of power is not, and has never been a law at all. Anyone in the country is entitled to disregard it. It is invalid ab initio (right from the start)”.
With the Crown removed we have nothing but a corporate communist occupation that pretends to be government. They are imposters and criminals with no authority.
They only have deceit and violence, especially gun violence via S&W M&P40 handguns carried exclusively to shoot dead Aussies with.
Interesting. Do you have a reference on that ruling?
I’m thinking of the ‘Bill of Right, William And Mary, of 1689’, the settlers brought with them under the ‘Act of Settlement, 1700 (UK)’, and was reinforced with the ‘Imperial Acts Application Act (NSW)’ and equivalents in each state. Along with the ‘Magna Carta’ it was ‘removed’ by catholic politicians, when it specifically prohibited catholics from being in either house of parliament, and stated: “Protestants which are subjects may have arms for their defence, suitable to their conditions and as allowed by law.” Removing this law is where ‘no right to be armed for self defence’ comes from.
A disgraceful over reach once again showing governments inability to determine sensible and measured controls.
Government is getting paranoid that people will fight back the first COVID-19 lockdown they locked the gun shops up straight away
For the CORRECT-THINKING is with the SOVEREIGN-THINKING.
“Stop looking to those crazy fools that took our guns for the next law on disarming the people, the government corporation has ceased to exist, the war is over (unless there’s a state of emergency/ marshal-law/ COVID-19) DO NOT GIVE UP YOUR GUNS! Use them to [de]FEND-YOURSELVES” lastflagstanding.com
The problem is there are too many councils, clubs, organisations and groups. There is too many wanting to be in charge, dividing our focus and strength.
ALL clubs, groups and organisations related to shooters rights in Australia should join together to put pressure to government so criminals can be the focus of law enforcement, not citizens.
Even if all of these organisations can agree to join under a common banner, with a single goal.
But it won’t happen, because all of these different groups want to be in charge, they want to be the one that takes credit.
I’m sick of it. I’m not a criminal. I am an Australian. I want my rights and I want the freedom to pursue them.
Hi Samuel. Some shooting orgs just look after events, others get involved in poitics. Some are shotgun, some are pistol, some are rifle, some are hunting, some are target shooting or gun collecting – so the number of orgs should not be a problem. The problem is that those who engage in politics, often do so poorly because they don’t have the skills to do the job they need to do. We do.
These people understand the power of the pen they have studied this to get there own agendas put forward
With no thoughts about what you or I might think .
We must stick together and vote these people out someone from the NSC must inform shooters on how to vote. Why does the process let them get away making false claims they should be making them table names of people and originations who have agreed to these changes or the whole parliament is a fast.
Just a question. I know someone that was charged with verbal assault. He’s licence got suspended and his guns are in safe storage for 5 year’s, it’s been nearly 4 years since the incident. Now can someone answer me this. The court case past last week and the person who got verbally assaulted did not show up on the court date because unfortunately that person had past away through natural causes. What happens now does the offence get thrown out by the court’s and will my friend get his suspension cancelled and his guns back?
I have spoken on this subject before , but here goes , how about ALL shooting groups get together and form a committee of say 2 from each body to combat these parliamentary idiots , THEN the shooting community would be a force to be reckoned with , BURY THE HATCHET and do this before it’s too late , I’m a member of most shooting bodies most you only hear from when they want your yearly dues , I would like to congratulate the NSC for DOING SOMETHING and keeping us informed thank you.
John Howard Is back.He took privite legal property from me when it wasn’t for sale.& then he took my Job. Ex Telstra Liniy SOLD..To the Mum& Dad Invastors of Australia.Did someone say he also fixed up the Murray Darling system with the proceeds They are all overpaid alters. Cheers
I mean LYERS
I have two air rifles, conventional spring piston powered, each stored in a hand-made 20 mm thick wood box that I made, both boxes bolted to a sturdy cabinet. Are the bad guys really going to break in to take these weapons?
Seriously?
Hi. My partner has ordered and paid for a new gun cabinet that meets the new gun laws that come into place at end of August 2022. Bunnings have had non in stock and have loads of gun cabinets on order to meet the new requirements. My partner today has just been informed that it will be mid September or later before the new stock comes in. Where do we stand after the dead line if we have not updated our gun cabinet as per the new laws? Cheers.
my situation is the same as Jane above! where do we stand? I have not even be told of this change until a week ago by my son-in-law. Obviously being a pensioner I had no choice but to source a safe I could afford, how much more do we have to keep forking out to to keep our our legally acquired, registered and paid for “GUNS”.
This change is all about taking away Australian citizens rights to even speak let along say something politically bias!
Its time Australians get motivated and make a stand against the road our Governments are taking us down.
These changes to our gun laws are just the tip of the iceberg of things to come!
There are so many more changes being forced upon us with no consequences if politicians get it wrong!
We all need to start thinking with our heads, get actively involved in the political process and find new emerging parties that represent our values.
From what I am consistently reading most Australians are fed up and seeking to vote out the rubble!!